Dr. Hannah Baczynski works with people of all ages—providing diagnostic and psychological evaluations for children as young as 2, adolescents, and adults, as well as individual therapy for adolescents. As the clinical director of Dakota Family Services’ DBT Program for Adolescents, she also provides Dialectical Behavioral Therapy and is a firm believer in using treatments that are well-supported by research and that match the client’s goals. When she understands the “why” or the function of the behavior of difficulty a client is experiencing, she collaborates with them to set goals and find new, more productive skills and behaviors.
Featuring Dr. Hannah Baczynski, Psychologist, Dakota Family Services
Tim Unsinn:
Welcome to Mind Your Mind, a podcast presented by Dakota Family Services, an outpatient behavioral health clinic located in Minot, Bismarck, and Fargo, North Dakota. In this podcast, I will talk with our experts about understanding and nurturing our mental health and wellness. I'm your host, Tim Unsinn. Join me each episode as we explore the intricacies of our minds, decrease the stigma of mental illness, learn practical tips for managing our mental health and wellbeing, and recognize when it's time to ask for help. Join me now to mind your mind. Welcome to this episode of Mind Your Mind. Our guest is Dr. Hannah Baczynski. Dr. Baczynski is a psychologist with Dakota Family Services in Fargo. Dr. Baczynski, it is great to have you on Mind Your Mind. Our topic is dealing with burnout, which many of us have dealt with, coped with, just gotten through. We're gonna talk about that today. Just a great topic. Thank you for bringing it up. Before we get to the topic though, there's a question I ask all of our guests, and that is, why do you do what you do?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
I decided to be a psychologist because I like to figure out why things happened and people's behavior, I think, was the biggest puzzle as to why things happened. So I started out just trying to decide how people do what they do, how they decide, what they decide and what makes them tick.
Tim Unsinn:
Great topic today, dealing with burnout, and I think that's something that a lot of us have, have either dealt with or are going through. So what is burnout and what are some of the signs you are in that burnout mode?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
So there are actually two different like stages of burnout. Most people before they get to full-on burnout are in something some researchers, some mental health professionals call brownout. And so brownout is when you start to get tired, when you start to not want to do the things that you're doing when maybe the stuff you used to enjoy isn't as interesting or fun anymore. You just have trouble getting going, getting out of bed, maybe at work you're making more mistakes.
Tim Unsinn:
So before you get too deep in there, one question that popped into my head-- is there a way to tell the difference between fatigue and brownout?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
Absolutely. So fatigue would be something that, you know, you might feel if you're not getting enough sleep or you're working maybe too many hours, but brownout is what starts to happen when you are really stressed a lot. So fatigue, if you were just tired from not sleeping, you could sleep or rest and that would go away. Brownout isn't the kind of thing that would go away with just sleeping one night. And if you push through brownout too much, you're working at too high a level or you're under too much stress for too long, you will get to burnout. And burnout is a state of just complete mental, physical and emotional exhaustion where you are making mistakes at work, you're forgetting things at home like paying the bills or you're not engaging in your hobbies, you're not going out and being social with your friends. You're maybe you have more negative attitudes about yourself and others. You just really can't do what you need to do. You almost can't even get out of bed sometimes.
Tim Unsinn:
So that would lead to different types of burnout then?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
Right. There are different types of burnout and a lot of the different types of burnout really they're just two big ones. And it really depends on if you are neurodivergent, like have autism or ADHD or are more of the neurotypical. If you are more on the, like, work burnout side, which can happen to anybody changing how you work, like changing the amount of work that you do, changing the pressure on you at work can relieve some of that burnout. If you're on the other side, the autistic burnout side, changing what you do needs to be pretty drastic. Where you aren't going to be relieved by resting, aren't going to be relieved by slightly decreasing what you're doing or allowing some mistakes at work. It takes a lot longer to recover and it is much more pervasive. So you're not maybe meeting your basic needs, maybe you're having more meltdowns or shutdowns. If you're in this autistic burnout, maybe you have higher anxiety, increased health issues. If you are autistic and you have this burnout, you might even go mute for a while or non-verbal, you have a lot of difficulties with sensory things where just generally sensory input like noises or lights are, are harder to deal with. So there's like work-related burnout that anyone can get and there's this other type of burnout, autistic burnout that you get if you're more on that side of the spectrum.
Tim Unsinn:
So one question is, is a change of job enough to change the burnout mode?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
At first it could be. And so some people get so burned out that even if they really like their job, they are just done. They wake up one day and they can't go back and they have to change careers completely. If you change your job, your burnout is likely gonna go away, but if you don't deal with the underlying causes of burnout, then your burnout's gonna come back.
Tim Unsinn:
So is burnout different from anxiety and depression and what are some of the dangers of burnout?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
Yeah, absolutely. Burnout can lead to anxiety and depression. Anxiety and depression can be part of burnout, but burnout is really situational. Like you are under a lot of pressure at work. You are, you have too many demands in your life. It doesn't even have to be at work. Like I think of people whose kids are in a thousand activities and you gotta go to an activity a day or even multiple activities a day. Like you can get burned out from parenting as well just the same way as work. And if you have work stressors on top of parenting stressors, you're gonna be more likely to get burned out as well. But having burnout can lead to depression, can lead to anxiety. But I was reading about a way to kind of test if it's depression or anxiety. So if you imagine going on a wonderful trip to like the beaches of The Bahamas or something, is that trip going to make you feel better? And if it does, you might be in burnout because you're getting that rest and relaxation. But if you are truly depressed going to The Bahamas, you're just gonna be depressed in The Bahamas. And so that won't relieve that feeling of tiredness, that feeling of not wanting to do things, that lack of motivation. So if a trip would solve it, at least for a little while, you might be burned out.
Tim Unsinn:
You're listening to Mind Your Mind. Our guest is Dr. Hannah Baczynski and we are talking about burnout and we've been talking about, you know, the differences and what it looks like and the different types and brownout and burnout. And this is probably like the million dollar question. So everybody pause right now. Get your pen and paper. How do we prevent burnout?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
So if you imagine that there is a curve, right, of performance and effort, if you put no effort into something, your performance is gonna be pretty low, right? If you have like a maximum level of effort, a hundred percent, if you try to go beyond that 100%, your performance is also gonna be pretty low because you just can't do it right? If you are, say, running a marathon, if you don't put any effort into it, you're not gonna finish that marathon. But if you try to run it as fast as like Usain Bolt or something, you're just gonna pass out and die perhaps, I don't know, not really die, but right, you're not gonna finish. Your performance is gonna be really bad. And so we have this like maximum level of performance that we can work at. And what happens is that people believe that they need to be working at 100% maximum performance all the time.
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
Like you cannot make mistakes at work or you have to take on more and more and more projects to prove yourself. And that's simply not true. Like most of us, most of the time would do fine at work or in our home life, putting in 70% effort that's sustainable. That's like trying to run a marathon at like a comfortable speed. You might finish. If you try to run at your hundred percent, you're gonna get tired, you're gonna get cramps, like it's not gonna work out and things are gonna start to decrease. You're gonna start to notice mistakes at work. You're gonna forget one of those activities that your kids have or you're gonna show up late or you're not even gonna pay for it or something.
Tim Unsinn:
You dropped the kids off but forgot to pick them up.
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
You forget to pick 'em up, right? So if you stay at a hundred percent effort for too long, your performance starts to suffer because you're tired, because there's too much on your mind. And so one of the best ways to prevent burnout is to remember that you don't have to be perfect. Like you don't have to give 100% a hundred percent of the time. If you stick at your sustainable level, which is probably around 70, 75%, you are going to be much less likely to get burned out. 'cause You're not gonna put all that pressure on yourself that probably you think other people are putting on, but maybe other people aren't expecting as much of you as you think. So that's really the first way to allow yourself to make mistakes, to allow yourself not to be perfect
Tim Unsinn:
Life's marathon, not a sprint. Absolutely. Let's keep that in mind. So once we've come to the realization that we are burnt out, what do we do for help?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
One of the things that you can do is if it's like a work related thing is go to your, your manager, your coworkers and talk about how to set better boundaries, talk about which projects maybe need more effort versus other efforts, prioritizing, and just really figuring out how to reduce those demands that are too much on you if it's at work or in your personal life for like work or personal life related burnout. Working with a therapist can really help on how to reduce some of those demands and figuring out what needs to happen and what doesn't need to happen throughout your day. You wanna build in breaks to just relax, whether it's for five minutes, 10 minutes, you know, whatever, and do some mindfulness, do some breathing, do a little bit of stretching, yoga, those kinds of things help your nervous system remain calm so it's not running at a hundred percent all the time.
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
Building in exercise, establishing routines, making sure that you're engaging in things that give you energy, those hobbies, those friends, family, those things that really you feel refreshed after you engage in. And then learn to build and reinforce boundaries like work-life related boundaries. It's like I said, if you got a new job, your burnout might go away for a little while, but if you don't know how to set those boundaries, if you don't know how to say no, if you don't know how to leave work at work, which can be really hard for people now that everyone's working at home and things like that, if you don't know how to leave those things at work and separate those, it doesn't matter how many jobs you change, you're probably gonna get burnt out again. The other side though with autistic burnout is you want to really bring it down to the basics. If you have this autistic burnout, you want to minimize even social interactions because those drain people with autism, social interactions, or they can. You wanna minimize stressful environments and unexpected things, a lot of sensory input. If you are feeling like you have autistic burnout, you might even wanna avoid the grocery store because lots of unexpected things happen. They have fluorescent lights, it's loud, you know?
Tim Unsinn:
There're people.
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
There are people like, yeah, bring, you know, get your groceries delivered. If you're in autistic burnout, that's okay. Maximize your sleep and rest. Increase spending time on your special interests. The things that you really, really enjoy. Increased stimming can also help. So stimming is any like soothing, repetitive movement. So the thing that we all think of is like hand flapping or rocking. But it can be a lot of different things like just rubbing your hands together or spinning in a chair or like any sort of of those repetitive movements. And then really increase support from others. Like have, you know, Alexa, remember to pay your bills or order food or those kinds of things. Have a friend do the dishes for a while. Lean on supports that you have, whether they're family or friends or neighbors or even just, you know, your smartphone. Lean on those to remember things for you to make sure that things are automatically happening. And it can also help to stick to safe foods, you know, whatever that comfort food is, stick to that for a little while.
Tim Unsinn:
It's food.
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
It's food.
Tim Unsinn:
It's food. Dr. Hanna Baczynski has been our guest on Mind Your Mind. Some great information on burnout and I know as we listen to podcasts, it's so easy with today's technology to pause and rewind and go back and listen again and again because there's so many pieces of information that help us, we want to do that and we encourage you to do that as well. And feel free to share Mind Your Mind with others. And I know that there are many have dealt with and are going through burnout. I think really important as well to have a friend that can be honest with you. Just that thing where there's no rules when we talk together, you know, they're honest. Dr. Hannah, thank you so much for being with us. Appreciate you. Before we wrap up, there's always that final question I ask all of our guests and that is how do you personally mind your mind?
Dr. Hannah Baczynski:
Well, we've been talking a lot about hobbies and things that are interesting and fun to you. And so I have a couple hobbies that I've taken up recently in the last like year or so, and one of them is ice skating and I have been taking ice skating lessons and I do that every week, which is really a nice physical activity. And then I have actually recently started trying to do those aerial silks where you do yoga, like suspended from the ceiling, which is actually really fun. Painful but fun.
Tim Unsinn:
It's the fall that'll get you <laugh>. Well, thank you so much. We so appreciate you being with us and appreciate you sharing insights on burnout. Thank you as well for listening to Mind Your Mind. Thank you for joining us for Mind Your Mind, a podcast presented by Dakota Family Services. You can't have health without behavioral health. Remember to mind your mind. For more information, links to additional resources, contact information, and much more, go to Dakotafamilyservices.org.
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Autism is sometimes perceived as a disorder that only affects children and adolescents, but it is actually a lifelong diagnosis. In this special Community Chat episode of Mind Your Mind, psychologists Dr. Hannah Baczynski and Dr. Megan Spencer explore the symptoms and nuances of autism in adults, touching on the history of autism spectrum disorder, the research surrounding it, how autism commonly presents in adults, and more.;
Though spirituality is often associated with religion, it can mean much more than simply attending religious services or praying. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn and psychiatrist Dr. Wayne Martinsen define spirituality and discuss its relevance in daily life, touching on ways people experience, express, and cultivate spirituality. They also talk about the link between spirituality, religion and meaning in life.;
Setting goals is easy. Working towards them is hard. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn talks with Dakota Family Services therapist Christy Wilkie about how to set healthy, realistic goals, as well as the importance of managing your expectations and staying persistent. Whether you’re starting an exercise routine, writing a book, trying a new diet, or building your career, keep these tips in mind when setting your next big goal.;
Fear is powerful. It can cause us to avoid problems, people, and even opportunities in our life. But it can also be overcome. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn speaks with Falan Johnson, a therapist at Dakota Family Services, about the function of fear and how to face it. Learn where fear comes from, how to identify it, and how to calm down and build confidence when you’re feeling afraid.;
In this episode of Mind Your Mind, our host Tim Unsinn talks with Dakota Family Services therapist Jessie Mertz about the “3 R’s”—Regulate, Relate, and Reason. They discuss what each term means, how they build upon each other, and how this approach can help you calm others who are experiencing distress.;
Schizophrenia is a chronic, complex mental health disorder that affects around 1% of people in the United States. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn and psychiatrist Dr. Wayne Martinsen discuss the symptoms and implications of schizophrenia, touching on its many effects on individual and family life. Learn about how schizophrenia is treated, how it affects physical health, when it tends to develop, and how it is perceived between cultures.;
Although the stigma surrounding mental health is gradually disappearing, it can still be tricky knowing how to talk about it. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn and psychologist Megan Spencer explore how to have a conversation with someone about their mental health, including signs that you should talk to them, how to start the conversation, and some possible reactions to expect from the other person.;
Are you feeling cooped up indoors? Join host Tim Unsinn and therapist Lucas Mitzel in this episode of Mind Your Mind as they discuss the importance of getting outside on your mental health. Learn about the benefits of green and blue spaces, activities you can do while outside, and how being outside can help improve symptoms of different mental health diagnoses.;
Many of us know someone who has been diagnosed with a chronic illness, or have been diagnosed with one ourselves. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn talks with therapist April Morris about how chronic illness can impact daily living and mental health, as well as how to seek support if you have been diagnosed with a chronic illness.;
Although the term ‘bipolar’ is sometimes used as slang to describe someone who is moody or indecisive, true bipolar disorder is a complex and sometimes severe mental health disorder that affects the way a person thinks, feels, and behaves. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn discusses bipolar disorder with nurse practitioner Amanda Daggett, touching on what the disorder is, what its symptoms look like, and how it can be treated.;
How much time do you spend each day looking at your phone? An hour or two? Multiple hours? In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn meets with therapist Christy Wilkie to discuss how social media use can impact our mental health, relationships, and behavior. Learn tips for monitoring your child’s internet use, as well as how to manage your own time spent on social media.;
While OCD is sometimes perceived as simply a desire to keep things neat and organized, it can actually have much more severe symptoms for those who experience it. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn meets with psychologist Dr. Megan Spencer to talk about who Obsessive Compulsive Disorder affects, what its signs and symptoms are, and how to seek help if you or a loved one has been diagnosed with OCD.;
Bad habits can be easy to start but sometimes very difficult to stop. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn and therapist Falan Johnson talk about breaking bad habits, including where habits come from, how to know if a habit is bad, and steps you can take to stop it.;
Are you looking for some help on your mental health journey? In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn and therapist Jessie Mertz talk about how to find a therapist, including what you should know when searching and what questions to ask when you meet a therapist for the first time. They also touch on what the letters after a therapist’s name mean, and how they apply to the type of services or treatment you might be looking for.;
Whether it’s from asking someone on a date or applying for a job, we all experience rejection at some point in our lives. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn talks with therapist April Morris about how to cope with rejection, including the common coping stages, the importance of acceptance, and how rejection can impact people differently.;
Like other personality disorders, borderline personality disorder is a commonly misunderstood and stigmatized mental illness. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn talks with Lucas Mitzel, a therapist at Dakota Family Services, about what BPD is, how it affects someone’s behavior, and where to seek treatment if your child has been diagnosed with BPD.;
Do you think you might be suffering from an undiagnosed mental disorder? If so, a psychological assessment might be able to help. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, psychologist Dr. Hannah Baczynski and host Tim Unsinn talk about what to expect from a psychological assessment, including what an assessment might include, what information you might receive from the psychologist, and what you should communicate with your psychologist before and after receiving an assessment.;
In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn and Amanda Daggett explore the topic of using supplements for mental health. In addition to talking about some of the most commonly used supplements like melatonin and St. John’s Wort, they also discuss the benefits, the risks, and the research surrounding various supplements.;
Feeling like you’ve got the winter blues? If you’re noticing symptoms of depression with the change of seasons, it may be a sign that you’re suffering from Seasonal Affective Disorder, or SAD. In this special Community Chat episode of Mind Your Mind, therapists Christy Wilkie and Lucas Mitzel discuss the common symptoms of Seasonal Affective Disorder, how it can affect other mental health disorders, and some useful tips, tricks, and resources for managing symptoms of SAD.;
Join Christy and Lucas, therapists at Dakota Family Services, as they share practical tips for building confidence when trying new things. From managing self-doubt to building resilience, this episode will empower you to approach new experiences with a positive mindset.;
In this episode, Christy and Lucas explore why relationships can be so hard. Join them as they discuss the characteristics of both healthy and toxic relationships, talk about the difference between normal conflict and abuse, and help you discover your love languages so you and your partner can best express your love to each other.;
In this episode, Christy and Lucas explore anxiety. Join them as they discuss the signs and symptoms of an anxiety disorder, what you can do to decrease your anxiety, and how to best help loved ones struggling with anxiety.;
In this episode, Christy and Lucas explore depression. Join them as they discuss the signs and symptoms of Major Depressive Disorder, what you can do to help yourself feel better, and what you can do to help your loved ones. They will talk about coping strategies, therapy interventions, and ways to help you identify when your child might need extra help.;
Change is inevitable. Join Christy and Lucas as they explore big and small changes and how they impact you. Learn why change can be so hard, even good change, and discover ways to manage it effectively.;
In this episode of "Is It Just Me," Christy and Lucas discuss the very important topic of suicide. Listen to learn about risk factors, warning signs, and what you can do to help a loved one who is struggling. Remember, you are not alone. If you need immediate assistance, call 911. If you need to talk to someone, call the Suicide and Crisis Lifeline at 988.;
Join Lucas and Christy as they explore the power of spending time outdoors on mental and emotional well-being. Discover practical tips, personal anecdotes, and expert insights on the benefits of getting outside and reconnecting with nature.;
In this episode of "Is It Just Me?" Lucas and Christy discuss ADHD, shedding light on its prevalence and impact on daily life. Learn practical strategies for managing symptoms and understand why your friend or loved one with ADHD does the things they do.;
In this episode of "Is It Just Me?", join our hosts Christy and Lucas as they delve into the complex relationship between the internet and mental health. With the digital age bringing information and social connections to our fingertips, it also presents unique challenges and opportunities for our safety and psychological well-being.;
In this episode of "Is It Just Me?", Christy and Lucas discuss how common it is for people to see themselves differently from others. Using their own personal triumphs and challenges as examples, they outline the things that shape our self-esteem. Additionally, they share simple daily practices to help listeners recognize and celebrate their own personal victories. This episode is filled with tips and engaging stories aimed at encouraging listeners to undertake challenges that foster self-growth and personal confidence.;
In this episode of "Is It Just Me," Lucas and Christy talk about what it's like to begin therapy. Feeling apprehensive about starting therapy is normal, but surmountable. Together, Lucas and Christy unravel common myths about therapy and emphasize the role of therapy in disrupting negative life patterns and routines that are no longer serving you.;
In the latest episode of “Is It Just Me?” Christy and Lucas tackle the transition from leisurely summer days to structured school schedules with warmth and wisdom. This episode is a must-listen for parents seeking guidance and strategies to help navigate the shift with confidence. Learn how to handle changes in routine, the importance of communication, and strategies to help the entire family adjust to and embrace the new normal. Listening to this episode can be your first step toward making back-to-school a season of growth and positive change for all.;
In this month’s episode of the "Is It Just Me?" podcast, Lucas Mitzel and Christy Wilkie, Dakota Family Services, dive into the complexities of trauma and its therapy. The episode sheds light on Trauma-Focused Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (TF-CBT) and the importance of creating a trauma narrative as a cornerstone of healing. The thoughtful discussions aim to educate listeners on the intricacies of trauma, the innovative methods used in therapy, and the role of caregivers in the recovery process. Through expert insights and compassionate storytelling, Lucas and Christy provide practical advice and real-world examples for individuals who have experienced trauma.;
In this episode of “Is It Just Me?”, Lucas and Christy delve into the world of mindfulness and relaxation techniques. From body scans to mindfulness exercises, they provide a soothing experience to help you unwind and distress. Discover practical tips and advice on incorporating mindfulness into your daily routine and learn how to prioritize mental well-being in today's fast-paced world.;
In this special additional episode of “Is It Just Me” join therapist Lucas Mitzel as he gives listeners a transformative journey within their own body and mind. In this episode, Lucas guides listeners through a soothing body scan to promote calm, mindfulness, and inner peace. This episode offers a unique mixdown of gentle narration, and relaxation techniques, leaving you feeling refreshed, rejuvenated, and more connected to yourself.;