How to Have a Conversation About Mental Health

Having A Conversation About Mental Health

Episode Description

Although the stigma surrounding mental health is gradually disappearing, it can still be tricky knowing how to talk about it. In this episode of Mind Your Mind, host Tim Unsinn and psychologist Megan Spencer explore how to have a conversation with someone about their mental health, including signs that you should talk to them, how to start the conversation, and some possible reactions to expect from the other person.

What to Expect

  • How to start the conversation
  • What to say & what not to say
  • Possible reactions to expect


Resources: Learn More

Things to Think About

  • Don’t wait for the perfect time or place to start the conversation. Instead, just try to talk in person and be attentive during the conversation.
  • Never tease, joke, or give ultimatums to a friend who’s struggling with their mental health.
  • Do you know someone who should talk about their mental health?

About the Hosts

Megan

Dr. Megan Spencer is a clinical psychologist at Dakota Family Services. She is passionate about working with individuals and their families and highly values the therapeutic relationship. Dr. Spencer enjoys helping people better understand themselves and their psychological functioning. She looks forward to working with anyone who is looking to better understand and/or improve themselves or their children and families. Her practice includes diagnostic and psychological evaluations and individual cognitive behavioral therapy.

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Transcript
How to Have a Conversation About Mental Health

Featuring Megan Spencer, Psychologist, Dakota Family Services

Tim Unsinn:

Welcome to Mind Your Mind, a podcast presented by Dakota Family Services, an outpatient behavioral health clinic, located in Minot, Bismarck, and Fargo, North Dakota. In this podcast, I will talk with our experts about understanding and nurturing our mental health and wellness. I'm your host, Tim Unsinn. Join me each episode as we explore the intricacies of our minds, decrease the stigma of mental illness, learn practical tips for managing our mental health and wellbeing, and recognize when it's time to ask for help. Join me now to mind your mind. Welcome to this episode of Mind Your Mind. Our guest is Dr. Megan Spencer. Dr. Spencer is a clinical psychologist and provides diagnostic and psychological evaluations and CBT. Dr. Spencer, it's great to have you on Mind Your Mind. Our topic is how to have a conversation about mental health. Great topic. However, before we get to the topic, a question I ask everyone early on, and that is, why do you do what you do?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

Well, I do what I do because I genuinely love helping people and I enjoy watching the journey of self-discovery, learning how to help themselves more when it comes to individual therapy. And when it comes to psychological assessment, it is a journey as well. And seeing people recognize things about themselves and learning more about themselves, which then in turn they have some direction to go to help.

Tim Unsinn:

Great topic as well, great conversation, how to have a conversation about mental health. The more and more seems like we are able to have those conversations more easily than say, five or 10 or 20 years ago. And I think that's a, that's a great place for us to be. So first, what are the signs?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

Yes. So first, when we're having a conversation about mental health, I think there's always some natural anxiety and worry that comes when we think about approaching or confronting someone when it comes to things that you're worried about with mental health. But first, I think it's important to understand what are some of the signs that might suggest that we need to have this conversation. And so in terms of signs, the things that I'm gonna just kind of briefly mention are gonna be out of typical. So when I, when I talk about these things, they're not signs that are very typical day-to-day behaviors or attitudes from that individual. So these are gonna be signs that are out of ordinary, different from what, what you typically see with that particular individual. And so some of those signs might be impulsive behaviors. So we all from time to time do things or say things that we are kinda like, oh, maybe we shouldn't have done that.

Dr. Megan Spencer:

But this is gonna be impulsive behaviors that are happening regularly and frequently and not in the same way that that person typically kind of behaves or, or does. And so impulsive behaviors might be they're all of a sudden, you know, suddenly snapping or very irritable with people, or even impulsivity with buying things or doing things that just seem very unusual for that person in what they do, or not functioning. And what I mean by that is, is not functioning as it relates to habits, right? So maybe all of a sudden sleep habits are totally off when someone usually had a pretty good routine and now everything just kind of is thrown off and they're spending all day sleeping or not sleeping at all throughout the night. Some of those habits could also be appearance, right? So when somebody is usually, not that we're always perfectly well put together, but typically not disheveled or looking a little off and dirty and, and like you, you just don't care.

Dr. Megan Spencer:

So appearance might change. Eating habits might change. So when somebody has been typically pretty good about trying to eat regularly, eat more healthy, all of a sudden you might find that those habits have decreased, significantly increased or a complete change in what the actual food that is being consumed. Also, talking about loneliness and despair, people sometimes give us the exact verbiage we need to know that there's a problem, we just have to recognize it and listen. Also, excessive worry or, or anxiety. Someone might, you know, we all have worry and anxiety from time to time, but if someone is like, oh my gosh, I can't even leave my house. Right? Like excessive worry to the point that you had never heard them talk about those types of fears or anxieties, others could be concentrating. This is, this is one that can be a little difficult because stress on some levels does impact concentration. And so that just can be, again, more regularly having that inability to focus and attend. Another sign could be substance use, so increase in alcohol use, or maybe they're reaching to other substances that they never had before. So those are all gonna be possible signs.

Tim Unsinn:

Alright, so that's some great information. It's a lot of stuff out of the, out of the normal. So once we are realizing this, how do we start that conversation?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

So here can be, I think one of the difficult parts is yes, we can identify things, but then it's kind of like, oh, what do I do? Right? So opening that door can be pretty difficult and I think I like to give a direct statement that might be helpful. So let's say you recognize a friend or a family is, is having one or more of those signs, right? And a conversation could start like, oh, it seems like something's up. Are you okay? Do you wanna talk about something? Or, you know, I've noticed that you're really just not yourself. Is there something that I can do to help? Or let's talk about that. What's going on? Those are very easy open statements that you can give that conveys a message of I care, I recognize something is wrong and I wanna help. So the other part of that is finding that moment or that time to have the conversation.

Dr. Megan Spencer:

And I don't think there's ever a perfect time. So that just doesn't exist. But it, what the point is, is having the opportunity where you and that other individual can be private and not feel that they're being exposed or others are gonna hear and not understand. So, so really thinking about and being thoughtful as to when you wanna open up that conversation and really how you do that isn't necessarily as important either, but making sure it's in person if possible because that's gonna be the best. And if it can't be in person then maybe through a zoom call. So you at least get that face to face and you can see kind of how they're feeling about that, opening up that conversation.

Tim Unsinn:

Do, do you feel that the conversations are easier to have today than say they would've been five or 10 or 15 or 20 years ago? Just because of all the attention on mental health?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

Absolutely. I think there's two reasons for that. One, I think the stigma genuinely is starting to go away. And people are starting to appreciate and understand that our bodies and our emotional world and our psychological world is all very much connected. And so it's so important to take care of all parts of who we are. But I do think because that stigma is, is lifted and it is better than it used to be. That's a huge piece. But the other is the resources. And I think maybe five or 10 years ago, there weren't those resources and that information that really allowed people to understand mental health for what it truly was versus this sort of scary dark, ooh, let's hide it under the rug and we don't wanna talk about it.

Tim Unsinn:

Right? Great stuff. Okay, what do I do once I've initiated that conversation?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

So first and foremost, trust your instincts. Our gut tells us a lot of what we need to know. We just don't always listen. So first, trust your instincts because you know your friend, you know your family member and you know that what you are seeing and recognizing is off and you care about them, so you wanna help them. So being a good friend or a good family member has no manual, right? It is more about trying to understand who that person is and what they need in that moment versus registering what's easier, best for you if, if that makes sense. So I think it's not about finding the perfect words or like I said, even the perfect time or space, but it's finding the opportunity to have that conversation that can be very intimate for the two of you or the three of you, whatever that looks like, don't worry about having the perfect words or the perfect time.

Dr. Megan Spencer:

And so some tips to help during that conversation is ask if they've seen a doctor, do you have a primary care doctor? When was the last time you had an appointment? Others, keep it casual, keep it relaxed. Don't come at the person you know with this therapy professional attitude. Be chill, be relaxed, be calm. Like a calm normal conversation or chitchat versus this, I'm the authority and I'm telling you something. And listen, for goodness sakes, listen, that is a skill that we all need to develop, I think a little bit better. So the other part of that has just listen and make eye contact. Let them know that you are hearing them.

Tim Unsinn:

So you're listening to Mind Your Mind. Our guest is Dr. Megan Spencer. The topic is how to have a conversation about mental health. So we, we've talked about the signs, the conversation, how to initiate that conversation. So once we've done that, what do we do after the conversation?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

So here's where it can get tricky too. And I want to address a few situations that I think will probably come up more times than not. And so first, when you have this conversation and your friend is hearing you, and the next thing they say is, I don't want you to tell anyone, that's a difficult statement. And it's totally understandable, right? Because this is really vulnerable in private information. But telling your friend you'll keep the secret is by no means helpful. And at some levels would probably be a lie depending on the severity. And so the best thing to do is in that say, you know, I understand why you would wanna keep this secret, but I'm really concerned and I really wanna help. So who could we reach out to? Or what would you be willing to do to help yourself at this moment?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

So we don't have to keep it a secret. Something else might be, what if my friend rejects my help, right? What if they're like, Nope, I don't want your help. I don't wanna go see a doctor, I don't wanna call anyone. Well, that's legit and it's probably based off fear, right? And so at that point, I think sidestepping a little bit and having a conversation about your own struggles, I think we forget sometimes that we can really meet people where they're at when we talk about ourselves too. That, hey, I have struggled with that in the past, or I am struggling with that and here's what I did that helped. Right? So it's not, you're not trying to convince them, but what you're trying to do is meet them at a place that they can understand that everyone deals with struggles once in a while.

Dr. Megan Spencer:

Something else that might happen is what if your friend tells you they're being abused? Right? So what if they're being abused or they are experiencing other types of trauma? Or what if they say, I'm having thoughts that I don't wanna live anymore. Right? These are things that I think make people not have these conversations 'cause they don't know what to do with that. And so, yes, let's say your friend says they're being abused or they're a victim of something, or they're experiencing these suicidal thoughts, this is very serious. And first I think you should say, I'm really proud of you for telling me and I really want to help. So let's figure this out now and let's find someone that we can reach out to to help.

Tim Unsinn:

Yeah. And I think too, you know, as you're talking about this, I'm thinking, who would not want to go through this journey by themselves? I mean, if somebody is initiating the conversation, and if you are that person initiating the conversation, I think it's back on us to say, I'm here for that journey, however, I can help you, I will help you find someone, you know, just continue the conversation, right?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

Absolutely. And I think that the last thing that might happen probably and does happen is what if you have this conversation and your friend gets very angry and upset with you and doesn't want to talk to you, that's their prerogative, right? And they have a right to feel the way that they do. And if that is the case, don't shame them. Don't make them feel guilty. All that I think someone needs to hear is, I understand that you might be angry with me, but I want you to know that I care about you and I will always be here. So when you need to talk or when you wanna have this conversation, again, please reach out, but don't stop there. If you haven't talked to them in a few days, reach back out. Right? Don't just drop it at that point. So those are kind of, some things I think are pretty big roadblocks to why people wanna not have these conversations. <Laugh>,

Tim Unsinn:

That is a great conversation and that is how to have a conversation about mental health. Any other final thoughts?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

I think in terms of what you can further do, this just goes back to sitting down with them and doing a little searching, right? Okay, who are some, you know, if you don't have a primary care, let's find someone. Is it Sanford, is it Essentia? Where do we wanna go? Or yeah, hey, I saw this person a few years ago for therapy and I wonder if they're still, you know, seeing people otherwise. I think it's important to remember as the person starting the conversation to not take their behavior or their comments personally. They're in a difficult spot and what they might say to you isn't meant to be hurtful, but they're struggling. And you have to remember that and don't give ultimatums. Oh, for goodness gracious, don't give ultimatums. Don't say, I won't be your friend if you don't get help or you can't talk to me about this, then, if you are not gonna get help, that is absolutely the worst thing. Don't tease. Don't try to joke. Don't share this information with anyone that is in that, that wouldn't be helpful. Right? Don't get frustrated, don't get angry if your friend doesn't want that help. But make sure that they know you care. Don't shame them, don't blame them, but just let them know that you are there and you genuinely care about them because that in and of itself can be enough for them to get help and don't give up.

Tim Unsinn:

Sounds like you need to be patient, kind and caring.

Dr. Megan Spencer:

You got it.

Tim Unsinn:

Perfect. And for those of you that are listening to this podcast right now and thinking about sharing that conversation or you know, people that should be sharing the conversation or they're, they're maybe just a little afraid to do the conversation, have them listen to Dr. Megan Spencer on this podcast. Great information. Thank you for being on with us. Before we go though, how do you personally mind your mind?

Dr. Megan Spencer:

Oh, that is being with my family. So that would be my two little girls and my husband, spending time with them, whether it's at home, outside when we have beautiful weather or just honestly chilling.

Tim Unsinn:

Thank you Dr. Spencer. Appreciate your time and talent. Thank you for sharing that with us. Thank you for joining us for Mind Your Mind, a podcast presented by Dakota Family Services. You can't have health without behavioral health. Remember to mind your mind. For more information, links to additional resources, contact information, and much more. Go to Dakotafamilyservices.org.

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